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Old 08-14-2008, 07:16 PM   #1
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Default Vocabulary terms you have learned from listening to Gord...

What are some words you all have learned from listening to G.L.?

Adieu- it means goodbye or farewell. I learned it from Broken Dreams. I'd never heard of the word before listening to this song, and even when I looked up the lyrics just to see how it was spelled, it still wasn't familiar. So I looked it up on dictionary.com and there it was.

Chaste- it means resisting the urge to have sexual relations with someone. I heard it from Forgive Me Lord. For a long time, I thought Gord was saying "chased". But I was browsing one day and happend upon the lyrics and noticed it said "chaste". Having never heard of this word either, I was about to go nag Char because I thought it was a typo (and that it was supposed to say "chased"). Then I decided I better look it up just to be on the safe side. Sure enough, HAD I not looked it up and went and poked fun at Char, she would have had reason to kick my butt. LOLOL

Navvy- according to dictionary.com, it means an 'unskilled manual laborer'. I think so Gord went and looked this up as well to add to the lyrics to CRT. I think a lot of people had never heard of this term before.

Rural Sprout - according to a certain corfiddler, it means 'a country boy'. But when I type this in at the dictionary website, nothing comes up... This must have been a term that Gord created himself...

I feel all scholarly like just typing this. Like I should've went to college or something...
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Old 08-14-2008, 07:22 PM   #2
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Default Re: Vocabulary terms you have learned from listening to Gord...

Here's another one I forgot

Wherefore- which is another word for "why". (I learned about this on this site, I started a topic asking it).
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Old 08-14-2008, 08:03 PM   #3
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Default Re: Vocabulary terms you have learned from listening to Gord...

Hexic Ring
Flaggin- Bigger than a pint of beer (most likely spelled wrong by me)
Uptight- means drunk or intoxicated.
thats probably it for me, im so well educated you see. ;-P
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Old 08-14-2008, 08:36 PM   #4
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Default Re: Vocabulary terms you have learned from listening to Gord...

See the drunkard in the tavern
Stemming gold to make ends meet

I had seen many drunkards in many a tavern but hearing "stemming" was a first for me.

Bill
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Old 08-14-2008, 11:48 PM   #5
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Hey BILLW - I was working on my "stemming" post I guess at the same time you were... then a phone call came in....just now hitting return.
I did not mean to "steal your thunder".

Paddle to the Sea - I may have been hearing Patriot's Dream wrong all along, but is the term uptight - for drunk - you cited - what I've been hearing as "tight' as in "and the bugler ..got tight...." ?

Also, the "Hexic Ring" - I am intrigued, as I can only think of p.p. "gonna grab my coat, my toothbrush, and my....hexagram..." somethin like that in i think "Gotta Get Away".

I am not into proving people wrong - far from it.. I am wondering if I have been hearing them wrong myself, or maybe they are different songs/words..... for the sake of conversation. I 'spect you are right.

Shut-up-and-Deal - do you remember the big honker thread about two years back on NAVVY? lol - there were probably ten different "definitions" found - but I gotta tell you, yours makes the most context-correct sense of all I have heard.

I found definitions for labourers (which I think you are right on Shut-up-and-deal, and sea-faring usage, and surveying - all three.

See, I thought, without looking it up, that in my field (groan) navvy was shop-slang for Navigator - one old term for the Surveyor who guided the train -track laying precisely with topographic leveling measurement so grades did not exceed - I believe 1.5% max.... which is only 0.68 degrees grade.....

They also kep 'em on-line direction-wise, and calculated the curves and staked-em out - they were ALWAYS spirals, to ease the train into, and out of the curve...infact one railroad curve, still used to this day, is a field aproximation so they did not have to use calculus back then... called the "Searle's Railroad Ten-Chord curve" - which allowed staking out to within a few hundredths of a foot by using a chart of ...uh... chords...straight lines... to ten points along the curve........and a device called a "Beaman Arc" - POINT BEING - so the Surveyor - historically misnamed the "Railroad Engineers". but called NAVVY'S at times...!! - that guided building and route, were called that because surveying....was the original form of... oh boy (covering head)...engineering.... all the way back to Egyptian times , and Socrates.

And in this century, surveyors who would "navigate" for a project, were sometimes called Navvies - I think there are several context-specific definitions, ... but your definition, IMO - makes the most sense - we are the "Navvies. who -work- upon the railroad, swingin our hammers to the .....' yep - I'm with ya.

WAIT A MINUTE - in addition to the well-looked up definition of Navvy, I just found all three references above, and the shop slang version I knew of in my field with the following INFO.COM SEARCH ENGINE, TRY THIS verbatim string in the multi-search-engine combinatorial info.com:

at info.com prompt:

Navvy Navie Navvie Surveying

- and you'll get a mixed bag - THIS IS THE HOLY GRAIL OF "NAVVY" REFERENCES - WITH - LABOURERS, SEAFARING USAGE, AND SURVEYING.....CHECK IT OUT...i could hyperlink it out the ying yang for you, but you can attach to it if you want to REALLY see some interesting usages of term Navvy. But, some definite surveying -context returns I'll not bore you further with elaboration. There is a whole book on Navvy's. !!


MY TERMS I LEARNED LISTENING TO GL -
Don Quixote - "stemming" - of which there is another well-known BIG thread....... SORRY BILLW - post script upon posting I saw you had added a post as well on this term....

stemming gold - came down to two very likely candidates 1. gold-smelters in blast furnaces meting the gold.... would line their smoking pipes stems with gold litttle by little to slip it out of the factory as I recall.... but that does not jive as well with stemming gold in a bar.. which led to the other likely definition found....
stemming gold - in old bars in mining camps and such, the floor-boards were set a crack apart - as in patio desk and fences know - so wood could swell without bowing...and drinkers, getting gold coins out... would drop them frequently while imbibing.. on the floor, where they would fall through the cracks.... to the ground beneath the floor.. where poor men would ostensibly crawl and gather them up.... stemming gold.....it does not lead to the sound of the word, but the context in the song is good....

I thin one of the metal shop craftsman in the forum knew of the pipe stemming - WES - was that you ? or IRON ? - we have some tool-and-die metal-crafters, and one gentleman who visited a gold factory, where they explained the pipe-stem smuggling, as I recall.... that one "sounds" likely.... but not in the song context.... the floorbaords one bags it for me on the context..... fascinating

Thinking of the vocabulary learned from Lightfoot songs, one subject comes to mind.:

You know, Gord seems to be a VERY well-read man.... his vocabulary is extensive, and also historically noteworthy - historical terms, that is... and sea-faring....which he seems to enjoy somewhat defining his oft-sung sea chanties and sailing terms, as in his opening song in many concerts, more historically - If It Should Please You......(paraphrasing) "sing some nautical songs... anf songs of the old HIGHWAYYY....nuh nuhnuhnanuhhnuh (oh come-on a corfid member [me] should do better on lyrics than nununana lol) I think I'm here to stay......put away those blues.... settle on back now.. I'll do my best for you...." and so forth -

he is often cited as singing many a sea-chanty, or referring to it himself, but as an exclusive defining term, but one of the strong influences in his music - just listen to "DayLight Katy" paraphrasing again "she walks by the sea where the sea runs wild, where the waves run steep and tall, etc..." = even in songs not about sea-faring.... he seems to genuinely love the ocean - and the great lakes

Like the IMAX FILM 'Mysteries of the Great Lakes" - there is a great trailer-teaser for that, with a rarely allowed usage of TWOTEF as a soundtrack song for the film, you can hear in the video clip, that starts with strange cliff-drawings and etc... with haunting use of Gord's TWOTEFat just the right time - this is in the Valerie McGee maintained "multi-hued, almost metallic halo blue-coloured" GL site I used to think of, perhaps incorrectly, as what once was MATHEW PHIFER's GL site - while he was going to NorthWestern U., as I recall... I don't see his name anymore in it.... Val am I correct ?

~geo steve

Last edited by geodeticman.5; 08-17-2008 at 04:51 AM. Reason: numerous mis-typing spelling errors
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Old 08-15-2008, 12:26 AM   #6
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Default Re: Vocabulary terms you have learned from listening to Gord...

Quote:
Originally Posted by geodeticman.5 View Post
You know, Gord seems to be a VERY well-read man.... his vocabulary is extensive, and also historically noteworthy
~geo steve
Indeed. The first word I can recall that sent me scurrying for the dictionary was "gentry". I'd never heard anybody use it before, and nobody since.
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Old 08-15-2008, 04:37 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RM View Post
Indeed. The first word I can recall that sent me scurrying for the dictionary was "gentry". I'd never heard anybody use it before, and nobody since.
True but I bet you've heard them describe renewed urban areas as 'gentrified' or maybe they just use that in my neck of the woods. It's like when they remodel everything so that the few people left in the area can't afford it anymore - and the yuppies fill the place back up.

Bill

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gentrification
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Old 08-15-2008, 05:52 PM   #8
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True but I bet you've heard them describe renewed urban areas as 'gentrified' or maybe they just use that in my neck of the woods.
That's interesting.....out here in the Wild West they just call it "razing". Regardless, the info you linked to adds a new nuance to the lines :

"See the children of the earth who wake to find the table bare
See the gentry in the country riding off to take the air".

Thanks
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Old 08-15-2008, 07:46 PM   #9
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Default Re: Vocabulary terms you have learned from listening to Gord...

"I've been UPTIGHT most every night walkin along the streets of this ole town."

Hexic ring....heck i cant find much on the net this time. I saw one somewhere online..its sort of an hexagon symbol sort of masonic in nature but i cant find them anymore...anyhelp from the gallery?







Quote:
Originally Posted by geodeticman.5 View Post
Hey BILLW - I was working on my "stemming" post I guess at the same time you were... then a phone call came in....just now hitting return.
I did not mean to "steal your thunder".

Paddle to the Sea - I may have been hearing Patriot's Dream wrong all along, but is the term uptight - for drunk - you cited - what I've been hearing as "tight' as in "and the bugler ..got tight...." ?

Also, the "Hexic Ring" - I am intrigued, as I can only think of p.p. "gonna grab my coat, my toothbrush, and my....hexagram..." somethin like that in i think "Gotta Get Away".

I am not into proving people wrong - far from it.. I am wondering if I have been hearing them wrong myself, or maybe they are different songs/words..... for the sake of conversation, I am not even looking em up. I 'spect you are right.

Shut-up-and-Deal - do you remember the big honker thread about two years back on NAVVY? lol - there were probably ten different "definitions" found - but I gotta tell you, yours makes the most context-correct sense of all I have heard.

I found definitions for labourers (which I think you are right on Shut-up-and-deal, and sea-faring usage, and surveying - all three.

See, I thought, without looking it up, that in my field (groan) navvy was shop-slang for Navigator - one old term for the Surveyor who guided the train -track laying precisely with topographic leveling measurement so grades did not exceed - I believe 1.5% max.... which is only 0.68 degrees grade.....

They also kep 'em on-line direction-wise, and calculated the curves and staked-em out - they were ALWAYS spirals, to ease the train into, and out of the curve...infact one railroad curve, still used to this day, is a field aproximation so they did not have to use calculus back then... called the "Searle's Railroad Ten-Chord curve" - which allowed staking out to within a few hundredths of a foot by using a chart of ...uh... chords...straight lines... to ten points along the curve........and a device called a "Beaman Arc" - POINT BEING - so the Surveyor - historically misnamed the "Railroad Engineers". but called NAVVY'S at times...!! - that guided building and route, were called that because surveying....was the original form of... oh boy (covering head)...engineering.... all the way back to Egyptian times , and Socrates.

And in this century, surveyors who would "navigate" for a project, were sometimes called Navvies - I thin there are several context=specific definitions, ... but your definition, imho - makes the most sense - we are the "Navvies. who -work- upon the railroad, swingin our hammers to the .....' yep - I'm with ya.

WAIT A MINUTE - in addition to the well-looked up definition of Navvy, I just found all three references above, and the shop slang version I knew of in my field with the following INFO.COM SEARCH ENGINE, TRY THIS verbatim string in the multi-search-engine combinatorial info.com:

at info.com prompt:

Navvy Navie Navvie Surveying

- and you'll get a mixed bag - THIS IS THE HOLY GRAIL OF "NAVVY" REFERENCES - WITH - LABOURERS, SEAFARING USAGE, AND SURVEYING.....CHECK IT OUT...i could hyperlink it out the ying yang for you, but you can attach to it if you want to REALLY see some interesting usages of term Navvy. But, some definite surveying -context returns I'll not bore you further with eloboration. There is a whole book on Navvy's. !!


MY TERMS I LEARNED LISTENING TO GL -
Don Quixote - "stemming" - of which there is another well-known BIG thread....... SORRY BILLW - post script upon posting I saw you had added a post as well on this term....

stemming gold - came down to two very likely candidates 1. gold-smelters in blast furnaces meting the gold.... would like their smoking pipes stems with gold litttle by little to slip it out of the factory as I recall.... but that does not jove se well with stemming gold in a bar.. which led to the other likely definition found....
stemming gold - in old bars in mining acmps and such, the floor-boards were set a crack apart - as in patio deskc and fences know - so wood could swell without bowing...and drinkers, getting gold coins out... would drop them frequently while imbibing.. on the floor, where they would fall through the cracks.... to the ground beneath the floor.. where poor men would ostensibly crawl and gather them up.... stemming gold.....it does not lead to the sound of the word, but the context in the song is good....

I thin one of the metal shop craftsman in the forum knew of the pipe stemming - WES - was that you ? or IRON ? - we have some tool-and-die metal-crafters, and pne gentleman who visited a gold factory, where they explained the pipe-stem smuggling, as I recall.... that one "sounds" likely.... but not in the song context.... the floorbaords one bags it for me on the context..... fascinating

Thinking of the vocabulary learned from Lightfoot songs, one subject comes to mind.
You know, Gord seems to be a VERY well-read man.... his vocabulary is extensive, and also historically noteworthy - historical terms, that is... and sea-faring....which he seems to enjoy somewhat defining his oft-sung sea chanties and sailing terms, as in his opening song in many concerts, more historically - If It Should Please You......(paraphrasing) "sing some nautical songs... anf songs of the old HIGHWAYYY....nuh nuhnuhnanuhhnuhI think I'm here to stay......put away those blues.... settle on back now.. I'll do my best for you...." and so forth -

he is often cited as singing many a sea-chanty, or referring to it himself, but as an exlusive defining term, but one of the strong influences in his music - just listen to "DayLight Katy" paraphrasing again "she walks by the sea where the sea runs wild, where the waves run steep and tall, etc..." = even in songs not about sea-faring.... he seems to genuinely love the ocean - and the great lakes

Like the IMAX FILM 'Mysteries of the Great Lakes" - there is a great trailer-teaser for that, with a rarely allowed usage of TWOTEF as a soundtrack song for the film, you can hear in the video clip, that starts with strange cliff-drawings and etc... with haunting use of Gord's TWOTEFat just the right time - this is in the Valerie McGee maintained "multi-hued, almost metallic halo blue-coloured" GL site I used to think of, perhaps incorrectly, as what once was MATHEW PHIFER's GL site - while he was going to NorthWestern U., as I recall... I don't see his name anymore in it.... Val am I correct ?

~geo steve
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Old 08-15-2008, 07:47 PM   #10
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Default Re: Vocabulary terms you have learned from listening to Gord...

yeah diff song on the bugler...
"tight" in music terms mean right on the money! As in perfect..
Gords band is very tight too.
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Old 08-15-2008, 07:57 PM   #11
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Verdant -green with vegetation; covered with growing plants or grass:

Muskeg-a bog of northern North America, commonly having sphagnum mosses, sedge, and sometimes stunted black spruce and tamarack trees.

Scrimshaw- a carved or engraved article, esp. of whale ivory, whalebone, walrus tusks, or the like, made by whalers as a leisure occupation
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Old 08-15-2008, 07:57 PM   #12
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Verdant -green with vegetation; covered with growing plants or grass:

Muskeg-a bog of northern North America, commonly having sphagnum mosses, sedge, and sometimes stunted black spruce and tamarack trees.

Scrimshaw- a carved or engraved article, esp. of whale ivory, whalebone, walrus tusks, or the like, made by whalers as a leisure occupation
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Old 08-15-2008, 08:25 PM   #13
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RM and BILLW -

My connotation of gentry - which I'd add I have only read previously, never heard spoken aloud, until Gord sang it, notably in Don Quixote

as:

See the children of the earth, who wake to find the table bare
See the gentry in the country, riding off to take the air

as noted above,

and it seems to me the term gentry, by my connotation personally would mean the large, somewhat wealthy outlying large tract or Estate owners rather, refer to what normal folk like you and I call going outside for some fresh air, or "I'm gonna get some air... in the rarified, pristeen world of the blue-blood and well-heeled, often this seems to be called 'taking the air"

so much for connotations - I'll look right now at the denotation in webster's -

phew boy get this, from Merriam Webster's On-line free version dictionary:

Main Entry: gen·try
Pronunciation: \ˈjen-trē\
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural gentries
Etymology: Middle English gentrie, alteration of gentrise
Date: 14th century
1 aobsolete : the qualities appropriate to a person of gentle birth; especially : courtesy b: the condition or rank of a gentleman
2 a: upper or ruling class : aristocracy b: a class whose members are entitled to bear a coat of arms though not of noble rank; especially : the landed proprietors having such status
3: people of a specified class or kind : folks <no real heroes or heroines among the academic gentry — R. G. Hanvey>

lol re:
1. boy I hope my birth was gentle - my mother was unconscious
2. my family has a coat of arms, but I fear I am not entitled to bear it,
and am not of noble rank to be sure.... dang it.....
3. Knowing the unique elitism that can be found in Academia, certainly not always - I taught here and there......its interesting to note that there are officially no heroes among the acadaemia, and perhaps us "folks" are a "kind" of people hmm ? and 'folk" -music . Ir would appear the academic GENTRY do not "officially recognize" HEROS OR HEROINES.

Well Pilgrim, I have my heros - 1.My father, 2. one rare professor that pushed me to my absolute limit.... and I would say I have my career as it were, thanks to the rare intuition this professor had of knowing on an individual level just how far he could push a person - homework to 5 am.... type of prof.... you curse them in school days, you thank them in your career progress. But was he "gentry" - not hardly. this fellow wore a buck knife, leather jacket, and snake boots. My knowledge-base academic and professional hero indeed. The man is a genius.

My personal hero - my father was a genius - I wish I had half his brains.....lol...then I'd be a half-wit... lol....esteemed in his field among colleagues, awarded meritoriously by his country in the space program.... but was he aristocracy or gentry ? Not hardly. He was a regular guy, singularly wise, a man of few words... but people listened when he spoke.... so smart it must have hurt in that brainpan..... CU's IQ tests could not define him, so he was asked to write a new test... and did... Not me.....my Dad....ta go...

Gentry turned out if real interest to me.....thanks RM

~geo steve
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Old 08-15-2008, 08:54 PM   #14
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I'd tend to think that 'gentry' as used by Lightfoot in DQ was meant to reflect on the class level of those who have as opposed to those who have not...
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Old 08-16-2008, 01:45 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geodeticman.5 View Post

Also, the "Hexic Ring" - I am intrigued, as I can only think of p.p. "gonna grab my coat, my toothbrush, and my....hexagram..." somethin like that in i think "Gotta Get Away".
Yeah....I gotcha. Assuming hexagram is a reference to an Eastern Religion symbol, it would coincide nicely with "cups of tea and all of that Zen" from "I'll Tag Along".

Last edited by RM; 08-16-2008 at 01:53 AM.
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Old 08-16-2008, 03:48 AM   #16
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Default Re: Vocabulary terms you have learned from listening to Gord...

funny, i've been singing some of these words along with the music and never knew what they meant!
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Old 08-16-2008, 08:26 AM   #17
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Default Re: Vocabulary terms you have learned from listening to Gord...

I had to look up "lee" in the song Christian Island. "Away from the wind, as the lee side of a ship" was the definition that made sense.

Coincidentally that helped me with quiz question #53 from the other thread.
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Old 08-16-2008, 01:23 PM   #18
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Char - yup, I'd agree. Upon further, if not mildly disdainful reading of the book definitions of presumed societal classes, I find the essential tree rooted in elitism. Not that of Lightfoot, but the terms society has constructed for the alleged varying classes . In my way of thinking, and what my parents held near and dear, is that it is widely open for debate that social classes, if you hold truck with the concept ( I don't) that being: said to be of a societal class, notably upper classes, implies being posessed of true class per se.

Moreover, the unfortunate but hard-to-deny cousin to societal class is also very debatable - the definitions of liberal and conservative. I don't wish to stir the pot on everybody's connotations of the terms, but rather simply connect them with regard to class(es), and in turn, [the] Gentry. It has been written, right or not, that to be conservative is to hold that the social elite, which are in this context written of as
1. Aristocracy
2. Nobility-Royalty
3. Gentry
4. The generalized term "upper class"

For purposes of strata that commonly are said to identify, in terms of taxonomy, societal hierarchically upper echelons: they are functionally equivalent in one regard. The sum total of 1 -4 are often said to be the social elite. And if one believes in true elitism, IMO they frequently believe in conservatism's denotation, and hence, hold with that as their connotation, or do so in part.

It is my experience that many self-proclaimed conservatives, at the conceptual right-end of the liberal-to-conservative line, with centrists or moderates in the middle, and liberals said of course to be to the left, do not realize the denotation of conservative, strictly speaking in etymology, which states that "a social elite, as in 1 -4 above, intrinsically need to be govermentally in-charge of the masses, and these social elitists are by definition conservatives". It begs the question IMO, and
indeed is a load of cr**. But we are reading of definitions, however archaic
or in violation of the norm in connotations.

The "masses", often said or written of to be one of the following, since denotations of the masses (read: "those that must be led by a social elite") include the alleged echelon of "middle" classes, as well as "lower" classes both, the "lower" i.e. "working" ; (read: labour classes) are often described as one of the following:
5. [the] proletariate
6. [the] minions
7. [the]"great-unwashed" [sic] pejorative
8. [the] Greek by origin terms: [the] plebeian, or the "plebs"
9. [the] hoi-polloi

and these are the 'bottom" of the socio-economic alleged "strata" .....
and ironically, IMO, can simultaneously be personally posessed of a great amount of class, and oddly by denotation, economically be of high(er) levels of class albeit of "lower" "socio-economic" designation. The "lower and middle classes" are also allegedly to be ruled by the social elite, per the denotation of conservative(s).

Just the middle classes for a moment, distinguished uniquely in my experience in writing by fewer terms, have been "classified" by among other terms, these:

10.[the] bourgeoisie aka the middle class
11.[the] petite bourgeoisie aka the "lower-middle-class"
12.the more vague state of middle class being otherwise defined as simply to be about town or in town and otherwise undistinguished. Most often said to be [the] bourgeoisie, or (begging the question) to simply be "between the proletariate (lower) class and the elite - aristocracy/gentry/nobility-(Royalty) (upper classes).


* Noting for a moment the term gentry in denotation above as being one of the upper classes (#3) - among the social elite, qualified to rule categorically the lower and middle classes, being an alleged social imperative if one holds with the denotation of conservative. Further, the denotation(s) of conservative state that the minions and bourgeoisie, et al above "need" a social elite to govern them, and intrinsically are not capable of self-governing.

To write of being liberal, only for the sake of finding where gentry fits in, has a denotation that IMO virtually no self-proclaimed liberal would abide by: "liberals are intrinsicaly incapable of self-governing; therefor the social elite [aka the conservatives, who by inferrence in denotation are the upper classes, are to be] the only entities capable of governing" [the poor, needful masses that think liberally]. Frankly, these definitions or denotations I find to be so abhorrent in concept to both self-proclaimed liberals and conservatives, as well as out-of-date, and so far from common usage as to be not only immensely surprising, but greatly and de facto, wrong.

In my experience, very few people lay claim to being in absolute terms unwaveringly liberal, ad most certainly not its denotation, (who would say they are incapable of self-governing as a class?" (setting aside for the moment the unfortunate sad folk posessed of low self-esteem and deflated pride, or worse yet morbid ideations) - arguably these sad folks might say they are incapable..which BTW Gordon writes of so compassionately IMO in "All the Lovely Ladies" on COTS.

So, if people do not agree with denotations of liberal, or definitions of conservative, where do they get there opinion, and where, if elsewhere, do they fall on the conservative line ?


Most people I polled for a paper I once wrote on this , polling in several segments of society: a cross-section as possible of private sector , public sector , and the presumed-to-be-classically liberal Academia, the "hallowed halls" categories.

Virtually all polled people first were asked if they felt they were conservative or liberal, if they had to pick one. Then, they were asked what "societally-defined" socio-economic class they believed they would be considered to be in (!!). Then they were asked what they felt that class meant, and then what does "having "class" mean to them. While all these subjects are far to involved for purposes of this post, its interesting to note that virtually everyone polled was astounded by the defintions or denotations of all the terms used, and did not agree with them. Moreover, hearing the definitions, they changed in many cases their self-described degree of conservatism or liberalism. And no one felt they were incapable of self-governing, yet most said most of the people they knew were not capable of self-governing.

So, after all was said and asked, polled, defined, connoted, etc., where did people say they fell in two schema:
liberal, conservative, or ?
and: various forms of - lower, middle, and upper-classes ?

They, for over 90-odd percent, once told the median and average norms of others, and the newest term told them in the poll: that of "centrist", or "moderate", being simply somewhere in the middle-of-the-road between conservative and liberal. This is also where, per a multitude of media pollsters have found a majority of polled Americans describe themselves; with leanings somewhat away frequently, and farther away occassionally from centrist or moderate

Almost everyone, having heard all the criteria, changed their self-proclaimed socio-economic and politically-related designations (which , believe me I will avoid here) to:

A. I am a centrist, or moderate. I am somewhat liberal on most things, and somewhat conservative on others. I am very conservative and liberal on a few things.
B. I do not agree with the definitions and denotations of liberal, or conservative, and do not agree with the socio-economic concepts of the lower classes, middle, or upper classes' designations and definitions.
C. I do not believe most of the ( one political party) are primarily conservative
D. " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " " "the ( the other party )" " " " " " " " liberal
E. I do not believe only elite classes or conservatives are capable of self-governing.
F. I believe I am.
G. I found to my relief and re-assurance responses for the most part of:" I do NOT equate socio-economic class with the concept of having true "class", being "classy" the quality of class, or the class of "quality" personally. I furthermore do NOT equate socio-economic "station" in life" ( or simply how much money or belongings, or what type I have)" with real, and personal 'class' "

I thought, you may be wondering, if all of the above, is of interest when one word is used and compared to "what is the opposite of that word", and what exactly does it mean (what does GL) mean by it: "Gentry" . Having torn all precepts apart and gone up and down and sideways on supposed "classes" of society, and their alleged ability to self-govern, and terms used to distinguish ptimarily the elite "gentry" versus who they (it) feel they are "above", I find Gordon's usage of gentry to be very astutely applied in comparison to the socio-economic opposite, so to speak, in the song "Don Quixote", in the lyrics so aptly and poetically contrasted with gentry again as follows, and to close, IMO, Mr. Lightfoot I will say again, is a VERY well-read man:

See the children of the earth, who wake to find the table bare
See the gentry in the country, riding off to take the air

Hail my musical hero, Gordon Lightfoot, and his near-magical imagery ability !

& - let the fur fly, all in good spirits. IMO yada yada lol

~geo steve - not of the gentry lol not even sure if I am bourgeoisie.....
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Old 08-16-2008, 02:13 PM   #19
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Ok, what's with the Hexagram thing???
grab comb, toothpaste, hat and "hexagram"??? how about a lugnut? might be more useful! Or perhaps there is a deeper meaning/explaination for this? I'd love to know what he means by this...
In my "mis-heard lyrics" list, I always thought he was saying "exit ring", not that I knew what that meant either, but the exit part seemed to fit.

That's is my 2 cents worth....
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Old 08-16-2008, 06:00 PM   #20
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Scrimshaw and Flywheel.
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Old 08-16-2008, 06:55 PM   #21
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PeterBro10 and RM I am trying to help find what a hexagram IS..... several unlikely returns and a lot of religious and occult and I-ching stuff:

in Gordon's "Gotta Get Away"

the reference to the hexagram:

I'm a real bad loser that's what I am
Gonna grab my hat and my hexagram
You can stick my money in an old tin can
I think I fell in love again


generally speaking:

HEXAGRAM - comes up in rife variations in wikipedia as a symbol of Judaism, Hinduism, Christianity, Masonry, Mormonism,
and the I-Ching.


one except from things about Mormon Temple symbols, cabbala, occult, mysticism,
and depending on whether the hexagram is in a circle or not apparently is strong
medicine.... in the following excerpt: (from) "Hexagram, By Sword of the Spirit Apologetics" - disucssion of symbols found in masonry on ...The Mormon Assembly Hall....


The hexagram, when enclosed within a circle, has a more sinister meaning to the occultist. This configuration can be observed in the window panes over the entrance to the Salt Lake City Mormon Assembly Hall. The Assembly Hall is a granite structure adjacent to the Mormon Temple and is used for conference meetings and public worship.


The six-pointed star (without the circle) is a familiar symbol to most people. It is the symbol of the State of Israel and has appeared on its national flag since 1948. In Judaism, it is known as the Star of David or Magen David (Shield of David). The six-pointed star derives its association from the tradition that David carried a exagrammic shield against Goliath.

The symbol is made up of two interlocking triangles pointing in opposite directions. It symbolizes the union of opposites and is referred to as the Seal of Solomon. The Kabbalists believed that the emblem had protective power and magical properties. In magic and in alchemy, it symbolizes the unity of the elements--the upward triangle signifying fire, the downward water and also masculinity, femininity, and the soul. (1) Of great antiquity, the Seal of Solomon appears in the writings and practices of magicians and has strong associations with Hebrew mysticism. (2)

#2 above in orange worries me a little... seems unlikely as well....

followed by

Symbol found on the front cover of The Greater Key Of Solomon by S.L. MacGregor Mathers (1914)

According to the 1914 edition of The Greater Key of Solomon, a hexagram within a double circle is shown with Hebrew inscriptions and is identified as a Pentacle "...which we make for the purpose of striking terror into the Spirits and reducing them to obedience," It is called The Second Pentacle of Jupiter and "...is proper for acquiring glory, honors, dignities, riches, and all kinds of good, together with great tranquility of mind; also to discover Treasures and chase away the Spirits who preside over them." (3)

The hexagram has powerful amuletic and talismanic properties. According to The Encyclopedia of Witches and Witchcraft, "As an amulet, the Seal of Solomon protects against the EVIL EYE and LILITH, the terrible Hebrew demon who steals children during the night." (4)

"The most important use of the Seal of Solomon is in magic, as a talisman to control the demons and spirits conjured by the magicians. The magicians' GRIMOIRES, or handbooks, give instructions for drawing the Seal of Solomon inside or outside the MAGIC CIRCLE." (5)

According to William Schnoebelen, former Satanist and Mormon, "...this star, when within a circle is the symbol of anti-Christ. It has 6 points, 6 angles, and an interior polygon of 6 sides hence the perfect symbol of 666. Though I have not found this on the Salt Lake Temple, it is right across the park, emblazoned all over the Assembly Hall. And it exists in a stronger form on the Logan Temple: inverted, with two points up." (6)



eeeshh...
hexagram, per Wikipedia:

A hexagram is a six-pointed geometric star figure, {6/2}, the compound of two equilateral triangles. The intersection is a regular hexagon. While generally recognized as a symbol of Jewish identity it is used also in other historical, religious and cultural contexts, for example in Islam...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hexagram

OK hmm still seems unlikely

and then


Hexagram, Inc.

is also the name of a high-tech textiles company that makes ....high-tech.....fabrics,art,robotics,acousitc imaging...all for art's sake.....and is a company that makes scanning trolley satellite imagery systems that tile an orthographic view of the earth together,(Hexagram, inc.) futher makes:

As an extension of the research work conducted with the Topological Media Lab (TML), Sha Xin Wei and his team are creating small wearable devices, such as jewellery and scarves, which can be used for improvised play. [Hexagram, Inc.]

and finally of Hexagram,Inc as well, a joint colloqium of hi-tech stuff funding

Colloquium Textiles Unlimited jointly organized by Concordia University, Hexagram and the CTT Group, will be held at le Marchι Bonsecours (350 St. Paul Est) in the Old Montreal on Tuesday, October 7, 2008.

and finding what the above will yield in money to sped on high-tech art-robotics-electronic clothing:

( I KNEW it.....money, funding, endowments, to make VERY expensive robotic art and electronic clothing experiments, such as at the Hexagram, Inc. involvement above in a conference in Montreal, where a competition is held for $$$$, below)

-- HEXAGRAM --

The 2008 Competition will make available more than $350,000 from the Hexagram Fund. The Hexagram researcher/members has until Friday, November 2, 2007, at 5:00 p.m. to submit their application.



AND. OOH BOY the following other unlikely but frightening definition:

The hexagram, when enclosed within a circle, has a more sinister meaning to the occultist. This configuration can be observed in the window panes over the entrance to the Salt Lake City Mormon Assembly Hall. The Assembly Hall is a granite structure adjacent to the Mormon Temple and is used for conference meetings and public worship.


Hexagram (shatkona) Related Terms
• swastika (my apolgies, no inferrence intended)
• Yantra
• Pentagram
• Sigillum Dei Ameth
• Unicursal hexagram
Related Resources
• Hermetic Tradition
• Freemasonry
• Templars
• The Tarot
Glossaries
• Symbol Glossary
• Alternative Religions Glossary
• Glossary of Magick and the Occult

Alternative Religion/ features/ Alternative Religions Glossary / Dictionary of Symbols

Definition: A hexagram is a six pointed star composed of two overlapped triangles, found in use by a number of faiths and cultures. Outside of the cross and the swastika, the hexagram is one of the oldest and most universal spiritual symbols.

It is associated with the Biblical Solomon, known as the Star of David in the Jewish religion. In Ritual Magick, it is called the Seal of Solomon, and represents Divine Union, being composed of a female, watery triangle, and a male, fiery triangle. The traditional elemental triangles of eartyh, air, water, and fire are derived from the seal.

When the points of a hexagram are connected, a heptagon is formed.

Hindu Shatkona

In the Hindu religion, the hexagram is called the Shatkona, and is equivalent to the symbolism in ritual magick. The Shatkona is the combination of the Shiva kona (trikona, triangle), the symbol of the God Shiva, representing the element of fire, and the Shakti kona, representing the element of water.

Ritual Magick
Ritual (ceremonial) Magick at Alternative Religions.
Chaos Magick
Chaos magick resources at About.com

The other major reference is to the I-CHING, and symbols therin, which I think would support RM's thoughts on "ll of that ZEN"

but the references are just variations on book titles about the I-CHING, and definitions, oes not seem to go towards an object one coud grab allong with a toothbrush on the way out the door...

LASTLY ....all I could find different...

finally...phew.. a book...odd..about how fictitiously the Nazi's win WWII, and the American's make hexagrammic jewelry that is controverisal and will get em all introuble under command of the Nazi's - the book title, evidently, as it is refeered to by the acronym TMITHC , much as we knowThe Wreck so well as TWOTEF, is called [the book]: "The Man in the High Castle", and is said to be written while influenced by the I-Ching book. Phillip K. Dick is the author. Apparently it is controversial enough that many interpretations are offered.

incl. partial, I-Ching discussion of the Hexagram

The final two hexagrams the I Ching gives characters are the same: Inner Truth. Tagomi forms the hexagram first--after killing the SD men. At first he finds no solace in the answer. He tries meditating on a pin that contains Wu, a source of truth in itself, and traverses universes. Juliana seems to "understand" the hexagram immediately.


trails end for this cowpoke......

Thats all I can find....

~geo steve
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Old 08-16-2008, 08:51 PM   #22
RM
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It's spooky to ponder.

Here's my story :

"Gotta Get Away" has him/someone longing to return to a lost love. In my interpretation, this past love interest of his explored different beliefs. Hence, grabbing the Hexagram in order to return to yesteryear well prepared.

Years later, the same theme is revisited in "I'll Tag Along": "cups of tea and all of that Zen".

And I'm sticking to it.
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Old 08-16-2008, 10:23 PM   #23
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Works for me RM

because nothing I turned up makes sense to me, until I find that my results supports your theory, which they do.

The Zen in I'll Tag Along always did make me wonder if Eastern Philosoph(ies) were part of his climb out of the bottle, a hardship few successfully endure. That he was able to do so while canoeing or sea-kayaking for hundreds of miles in near-arctic waters is astounding to me as a tale of strength, self-discipline, and human achievement.

The I-Ching part of this, supports your Zen theory RM. Gotta hand it to ya, It has me otherwise stymied. Its the only viable theory I have heard.

Of course, even the best song-writer at times might use a word because it rhymes and works in the context, and in the process, come up with an occassional huh? - type of word usage, but I think not when I look at the lyrics:

Paper matches in the afternoon
Cups of tea and all of that Zen
I think it's time we took a walk outside
It seems there is no oxygen
This time tomorrow we might all be packed and gone

knowing Lightfoot's strength in lyricism, and the fact that of the two rhyming words above in blue,
Zen and oxygen; oxygen is the more likely candidate of a rhyming pair that worked, allthough perhaps might have been hard to come up with, suggesting to me that in turn, Zen, of the two, is the intentional word to start with. No what I mean ?.

Well, enough of that Zen....

~geo steve
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Old 08-17-2008, 12:15 AM   #24
geodeticman.5
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PaddletotheSea - I'm with ya on "uptight" and"tight" - in the different songs, and I also now know the term "tight" for a "band being "tight" - in synch; good. Thanks !

Regarding hexic ring: [sic]

If you want to skip the "yada yada' as was said above, go right to yellow.

Regarding hexagram versus hexic ring - if you really want to know the difference, I think I pretty well played out the web in info on wikipedia et al anyway on hexagram - from "Gotta Get Away, but you mentioned as well hexic ring. I'm not sure what song it is from , but the only definition I know on a hexic ring - which you expressed frustration as did a few others on what is the hexic ring - not much on the web, etc... here it is... and I am real sure lol that Gord did not mean this... whatever song the hexic ring is from -I'd love to know..... OK here goes....- trying to be helpful in return -

Hexic Ring:

The hexic part:

Names of polynomials by degree

Polynomials with small degrees may be named according to their degree as follows:

★ Degree 1 - linear

★ Degree 2 - quadratic

★ Degree 3 - cubic

★ Degree 4 - quartic

★ Degree 5 - quintic

★ Degree 6 - sextic ''or'' hexic



And... in keeping, mathematically the ring part of hexic ring:

Formal definition [of ring]

A 'ring' is a set ,R equipped with two binary operations +colon R imes R
ightarrow R and cdotcolon R imes R
ightarrow R (where imes denotes the Cartesian product), called ''addition'' and ''multiplication'', such that:

★ ,(R, +) is an abelian group with identity element ,0, so that , orall a, b, c in R, the following axioms hold:


★ ,a + b in R


★ ,(a + b) + c = a + (b + c)

etc. but where:

Given a ring R, the polynomial ring R[''x''] is the set of all polynomials in ''x'' that have coefficients chosen from R. In the special case that R is also a field, then the polynomial ring R[''x''] is a principal ideal domain and, more importantly to our discussion here, a euclidean domain.
It can be shown that the degree of a polynomial over a field satisfies all of the requirements of the ''norm'' function in the euclidean domain. That is, given two polynomials ''f''(''x'') and ''g''(''x''), the degree of the product ''f''(''x'')•''g''(''x'') must be larger than both the degrees of ''f'' and ''g'' individually. In fact, something stronger holds:
: deg( ''f''(''x'') • ''g''(''x'') ) = deg(''f''(''x'')) + deg(''g''(''x''))


So, in short, a hexic ring - and I mean the ONLY hexic ring I can find, is

A sixth (or hexic) order polynomial ring( is a set ,R equipped with two binary operations ) that also that defines a Euclidean domain etc.


and I'm REAL sure Gord did not mean this, as well read as he is LOL !!

BTW - The only other refence to hexic ring, that also seperates the two terms but contains them, and are within the context of the combinatorial search engine info.com - that accesses 6 different popular search engines and collates the results, is apparently a popular XBOX game (Hexic..?)[sic], and..Tetris.
And, together, an overheating problem gamers must just have tizzies over is called the Red Ring of Death, for which their is a special cooling fan. A fan made just for stopping the red ring of death overheating. Fascinating, captain. Not.


~holy polynomials batman !

~geo steve ....lol
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Old 08-17-2008, 12:20 AM   #25
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Default Re: Vocabulary terms you have learned from listening to Gord...

Sorry guys.... I think I am starting to get my mind off of hard things to get my mind off of....... short post, just for S & G .. -sigh- I don't mean for it to be at your expense. As I read all the above I did, enjoying the thread, I think I bored the living cr** out of y'all..... here and there anyhoo....

~geo steve
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