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Old 09-29-2012, 10:00 PM   #1
KHester
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Default Any ideas about these clips

Just found these audio clips on youtube I've never seen these before

They were posted with the info

New York, March 8, 1987

It sounds very much like a tv show. Gord and his guitar.

Any ideas where these are from?


there are 3 clips,
Shadows
East of Midnight
I'll Tag along



Shadows
Gordon Lightfoot - Shadows - YouTube





East of Midnight

Gordon Lightfoot - East Of Midnight - YouTube



I'll Tag along

Gordon Lightfoot - I'll Tag Along - YouTube


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Last edited by KHester; 09-29-2012 at 10:04 PM. Reason: Typo
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Old 09-29-2012, 11:35 PM   #2
charlene
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

Lightfoot plays an all acoustic set in New York as part of a WNEW benefit.

http://www.lightfoot.ca/chron04.htm
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Old 09-29-2012, 11:50 PM   #3
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

I know Gord has said in the past that David Foster had input only on "Anything For Love" but I wonder if the truth is that Foster hung around the recording sessions for more than that. You know how the Beatles released "Let It Be" naked without the Phil Spector influence. I wish Gord had re-recorded EOM with no David Foster influence at all. That guy is poison!
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Old 09-30-2012, 01:21 AM   #4
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

Hear, hear. I'm not a fan of the David Foster production style at all. He artistically ruined one of my favorite bands, Chicago, after he got his hands on it, even though it enjoyed commercial success under his reign.
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Old 09-30-2012, 02:44 AM   #5
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

Quote:
Originally Posted by charlene View Post
Lightfoot plays an all acoustic set in New York as part of a WNEW benefit.

http://www.lightfoot.ca/chron04.htm

and...

WNEW New York - March 8, 1987
This is part of The Mixed Bag series. Lightfoot is interviewed by Pete Fornatale. Lightfoot plays I'll Tag Along and Morning Glory live/solo in the studio.

Last edited by jj; 09-30-2012 at 02:48 AM.
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Old 09-30-2012, 05:23 AM   #6
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

I posted those up on Youtube. Those are some of my favorite Lightfoot tunes, especially East Of Midnight, though I don't like the production/arrangements on the album at all, I think it contains some of his absolute best songwriting. The acoustic versions are so much more emotional and deep in my opinion. It's a shame the one's I posted are from one of the only existing bootleg recordings of him performing those songs acoustically. If only he'd play those songs live more often...
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Old 09-30-2012, 08:41 AM   #7
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

Quote:
Originally Posted by peter k View Post
I posted those up on Youtube. Those are some of my favorite Lightfoot tunes, especially East Of Midnight, though I don't like the production/arrangements on the album at all, I think it contains some of his absolute best songwriting. The acoustic versions are so much more emotional and deep in my opinion. It's a shame the one's I posted are from one of the only existing bootleg recordings of him performing those songs acoustically. If only he'd play those songs live more often...
OK Mrgoldmind123
I think it is time that you come clean and confirm that the three "videos" that you created and uploaded to youtube were indeed based on the superb bootleg audio of the 1987 WNEW Folkfest broadcast, which is In My Honest Opinion one of the very best available
But you should also admit that you misattributed the date to March 8th 1987 when that FM broadcast was it seems actually on 13 September
I'll admit now to being just as bad a I see that I devised some CD artwork (which I will attach) and made a typo so that my front insert claims it was September 23rd a day Gord was in California apparerntly!
I have compared your three soundtracks with the corresponding mp3s of the bootleg set and it is clear that they are the same particularly Gord's rare song title intro and Terry's licks at ghe end of EOM and an exclamation by Gord at the end if Shadows (which just as at the recent Tarrytown NY concert was the second part of a medley with Spanish Moss)
Whatever the acoustic East Of Midnight has long been one of my favourite "Recordings Of Independant Origin" so much so that it occupies a deserved place in my personal list of "Extra Rare" items and might well be included in my planned 80 minute "Desert Island Disc" CD collection.
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Old 09-30-2012, 10:48 AM   #8
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

Quote:
Originally Posted by peter k View Post
I posted those up on Youtube. Those are some of my favorite Lightfoot tunes, especially East Of Midnight, though I don't like the production/arrangements on the album at all, I think it contains some of his absolute best songwriting. The acoustic versions are so much more emotional and deep in my opinion. It's a shame the one's I posted are from one of the only existing bootleg recordings of him performing those songs acoustically. If only he'd play those songs live more often...
Hi Peter, thanks for posting these clips..ITA was played acoustically a few weeks ago in Tarrytown when I was there ..You never know when he'll play it!
I have no idea what John is going on about...
Hope all is well with you and you can make it to Massey...
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Old 09-30-2012, 11:00 AM   #9
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

Thanks everyone for filling in the info for me.

EOM had some great stuff on it.

In the minds of the producers, record company etc...
I'm sure they were trying to fit in with the current time (1980'S) frame music.

With all the current technology, a recording engineer like Bob Doidge could bring it in the
studio and totally remix it
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Old 09-30-2012, 04:25 PM   #10
peter k
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

Hey John, I think you misunderstood my post. I wasn't taking credit for the bootleg recording itself, only for posting a few selections from it on Youtube. As for the date of the recording, if I got it wrong then it must have been the site I downloaded it from that had the wrong date. Sorry about that. I was only trying make some rare Lightfoot gems more available for people to enjoy, much like yourself...

Charlene, glad you enjoyed the clips That's so cool that you got to hear him play I'll Tag Along live. I'll be at Massey on Nov 14 on the right floor in aisle 3 row 1 seat 37. Maybe I'll see you...
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Old 10-01-2012, 10:11 AM   #11
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

CD Art...

The CD cover says WNET not WNEW

It's Pete Fornatale not Fornatali
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Old 10-01-2012, 11:46 AM   #12
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3pennies View Post
CD Art...

The CD cover says WNET not WNEW

It's Pete Fornatale not Fornatali
Many many thanks to my fellow New Jerseyan
I'll be soon be revising my front insert artwork to correct the date so
I will also correct the radio station's call sign.
When I looked at the back insert I suspected that I had got Pete's name wrong (I thought it might be Formatali) so I will be revising that too
While I am at it I will also resize both to 96 pixels per inch which on my computer/HP printer pairing seems to usually produce correctly sized inserts

Quote:
Originally Posted by charlene View Post
I have no idea what John is going on about...
I am at a loss to understand why Char had trouble understanding my point


Quote:
Originally Posted by peter k View Post
Hey John, I think you misunderstood my post. I wasn't taking credit for the bootleg recording itself, only for posting a few selections from it on Youtube. That's so cool that you got to hear him play I'll Tag Along live. I'll be at Massey on Nov 14 on the right floor in aisle 3 row 1 seat 37. Maybe I'll see you...
Sorry Peter I just thought that the way you expressed the lineage of your videos was unclear as it could have been a different bootleg.
I have no idea yet where we will be sitting on the 14th but I have noted your seat and will attempt to bump into you during the intermission
(I am 5' 11" very white haired and will be stumbling about with a cane)
Finally whilst searching here for posts about this wonderful Folkfest recording I found a thread that I must have missed back in 2004 that included the details of the venue by Val who was there See:-
http://www.corfid.com/vbb//showpost....51&postcount=7

Last edited by johnfowles; 10-01-2012 at 02:08 PM.
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Old 10-01-2012, 11:53 AM   #13
charlene
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

must be a Canadian thing..Peter didn't understand either.
lol
He never claimed he created the videos... He only posted them.
Someone else has them loaded as well and put them on youtube a year ago. http://www.youtube.com/user/MrGoldMind123?feature=watch
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Old 10-01-2012, 08:53 PM   #14
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

MrGoldMind123 is my Youtube account name. I uploaded those songs with still photos of Lightfoot (not videos) because it seemed tasteful and easier than creating fancy slideshows like many people do on Youtube. For some of them I used the appropriate album covers found on Google, and for the bootleg rarities I just used images of Lightfoot performing found on Google because I didn't know if the bootlegs had album covers or not, or if they had ever been officially released. My copies of the bootlegs were downloaded from a website called sugarmegs http://tela.sugarmegs.org/alpha/g.html
If you scroll down alphabetically to the Gordon Lightfoot section there's a bunch of great live recordings from different eras, though I'm sure most of the senior members of this forum are familiar with them already. As for the date of the New York Folk Fest in 1987 I got that from the official Lightfoot website where it says the date was March 8, 1987.
http://www.lightfoot.ca/radioapp.htm
I don't know who recorded the original bootleg or started circulating it but it definitely wasn't me because I was only 7 years old at the time...
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Old 10-01-2012, 10:46 PM   #15
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aha - the plot thickens..
lol

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Old 10-02-2012, 12:46 AM   #16
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

Quote:
Originally Posted by johnfowles View Post
OK Mrgoldmind123
...... which is In My Honest Opinion " ........
This not very subtle insert sounds like tautology to me (who would say "in my dishonest opinion") , however a quick Google does suggest there are alternatives to "humble" in this acronym which I thought was a given - so perhaps I jumped to an unreasonable conclusion previously. Let's face it John using humble to describe his views was a bit out there even by his own lofty standards !

Nonetheless if I see it used in the Fowlsian sense again I will assume either the 3rd one is implied from the following list , or possibly the last one . Not that I want ruffle anyones feathers....



Rank Abbr. Meaning
****** IMHO In My Humble Opinion
***** IMHO In My Honest Opinion
**** IMHO Is My Hearing Aid on?
*** IMHO Internet Media House (Russian media-buying agency)
*** IMHO In My Holy Opinion
** IMHO In My Hesitating Opinion
** IMHO In My Highest Opinion
* IMHO International Medical Health Organisation
* IMHO I Might Have Ostriches

( from http://www.acronymfinder.com/IMHO.html )
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Old 10-02-2012, 10:49 AM   #17
charlene
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oh yeah - there's gonna be fun in TO in November..lol

The Canuck/Brit/Aussie meet up @ Massey.

Pay per View - 29.99
lol
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Old 10-02-2012, 02:43 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by charlene View Post
oh yeah - there's gonna be fun in TO in November..lol

The Canuck/Brit/Aussie meet up @ Massey.

Pay per View - 29.99
lol
I am choosing to ignore the infantile blatherings from down under (which is where the right dishonourable "gentleman" should be... preferably at least six feet down to avoid any residual odours from poluting the atmosphere of the purer Northern Hemisphere) (that was a none too subtle reference to the most famous book by my favourite author, Nevil Shute:
his "On The Beach" postulated that after a world nuclear war Melbourne would be the location of the end of mankind a chilling thought).
Instead I will concentrate on this understanding/misunderstanding business because it now appears that I correctly identified young Peter K as being MrGoldMind123 and that he did indeed create those "videos" and was the sole uploader of them (there was no "somebody else"), what surprises me again is that the downloaded audio file from sugarmegs sounds a heck of a lot better than it has any logical right to
(geek speak interlude go and twiddle your thumbs or something Char)
If you download the sound file using the download link from sugarmegs
(which is to:-
http://www.archive.org/serve/GordonL...1987-09-13.wma )
you get a relatively smallish 43 minute long 12.4MB file named
GordonLightfoot1987-09-13.wma where the wma file extension indicates that it is a Windows Media Audio format file.
If you then were to be so bold as to analyse it with the most excellent free utility mediainfo from:-
http://mediainfo.sourceforge.net/en
you will see the results as in the screenshot that I will be attaching
 
note that with all audio files their file size is directly proportional to what is somewhat oddly named the "sampling rate" which is measured in bits per second or in other words the "bit rate" and the units are commonly referred to as KBPS for KiloBits Per Second
If you are unfamiliar with this there is of course the inevitable wiki at:-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bit_rate
so as you can see from the screenshot this wma file is encoded at the distinctly low rate of only 40 KBPS
by comparison on that wiki is a listing of various mp3 bitrates at
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bit_rate#MP3
including
96 kbit/s - generally used for speech or low-quality streaming
and
128 or 160 kbit/s – low-to-standard bitrate quality; difference can sometimes be obvious
192 kbit/s - a commonly used high-quality bitrate
320 kbit/s - highest level supported by MP3 standard
if you check the wma wiki you can read
"Microsoft also claimed that WMA delivered "near CD-quality" audio at 64 kbit/s"
also
"Microsoft claims that audio encoded with WMA sounds better than MP3 at the same bit rate"
and
"Microsoft has sometimes claimed that the sound quality of WMA at 64 kbit/s equals or exceeds that of MP3 at 128 kbit/s"
despite that as we all know it is mp3 that has become the universal standard for distributing music files
Andy T's erudite report on his own experiments at
http://www.corfid.com/vbb/showpost.p...0&postcount=11
stated:-
"Usually over 144kbs in stereo I found eliminated most of that "treble warble" you get from compression,128 isn't bad either, but you can tell it's an MP3 more easily. So I tend to just go with an average bitrate of 144 or 160, sometimes 128 if the track is not as important"
Personally I use the better 192 value.
Of course both mp3 and wma formats are "lossy" therefore reconstituting a CD from them can never replicate the full sound spectrum which means that purists and audiophiles (where is the long AWOL Sydneysider Gunter? the more acceptable (less ugly) face of Oz) insist on lossless compression such as FLAC (Free Lossless Audio Codec)
due to that in fact the prime audio bootleg torent listing website, dimeadozen. bans mp3s completely (there is a torrent for the Folkfest flac set showing but at the moment there are no seeders)
For comparison CD standard files are in the PCM format and their audio bitrate is 1,411.2 Kbit/s
OK end of my little geek speak section you can come out of hiding now Char
The other point discussed was the date of the recording: as I revealed in the downloaded filename and as recorded on Wayne's 1987 Tour Dates page the date was Septembe 13th.
I checked Wayne's Radio Appearances page and found that on March 8,1987 Gord was interviewed byPete Fornatale (whose name Wayne also mispelt as Fornatel). to confuse matters on both dates Gord performed Madam Charlene's Signature song ITA.
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Old 10-02-2012, 05:46 PM   #19
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

Fascinating . Not.

Actually opportunity knocks. A forward thinking Dr. should leap on the opportunity and prescribe (in lieu of drugs) the reading of Johns posts for those afflicted with insomnia. A sure cure.

Lesser known ( on the technical side ): John's posts have their own form of measure also in the format of bits.
" B/bit(s) ." What does the "B" stand for you ask ? A : Boring

To give him his due , that preceding post may well have managed to include the most B/bits able to fit neatly on a screen ever . He's maxed it out ! Only someone as dedicated as John is to his art could do it.
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Old 10-03-2012, 02:56 AM   #20
peter k
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

Since we were on the topic of live/acoustic versions of songs from the East Of Midnight album, I thought I would take the opportunity to ask if any of the senior members on this forum might happen to know if any other bootleg recordings of these songs being played live exist/circulating in the Lightfoot fan community, other than the above mentioned New York Folk Fest from 1987?

According to the Tour Schedule section of the Lightfoot website he was playing I'll Tag Along, East Of Midnight and A Lesson In Love as part of his regular set list between 1987 until about 1992. http://www.lightfoot.ca/tourschd.htm It would seem kind of strange if only one bootleg recording from this era would exist for a star as big as Gordon Lightfoot.

There's also a great clip I noticed on Youtube of Lightfoot playing Knotty Pine at the Ian and Sylvia Reunion Concert from 1986 on Youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfl0rAWMutU
I read somewhere that apparently he also performed East Of Midnight and A Lesson In Love at this show, but the full renunion show isn't on Youtube, just a few clips. I wonder if that full video exists somewhere maybe in the CBC archives?
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Old 10-03-2012, 10:15 AM   #21
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Hi Peter, you can bet CBC has everything ever recorded.

Being the taxpayers that fund the CBC I think it is our right and duty to obtain any and all footage that pertains to your queries.

So when would you like to meet on Front St. by the Glen Gould bench outside the CBC bldg. and get what is ours?

If only it was that easy... The only hope we have is that the talking heads in the archive department put up some other clips as I've noticed they have shortened some and removed some at different times so perhaps one day they will decide to put up some unseen stuff and make this taxpayer happy!

If anyone else can help please do...
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Old 10-03-2012, 11:25 AM   #22
charlene
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I probably have the whole show on an old dusty video in my boxes of 'stuff'...I have to get back to transferring that 'stuff' to my computer and get it put on VIMEO/dailymotion or some such site..





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Old 10-03-2012, 06:14 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydney Steve View Post
Fascinating . Not.

Lesser known ( on the technical side ): John's posts have their own form of measure also in the format of bits.
" B/bit(s) ." What does the "B" stand for you ask ? A : Boring

To give him his due , that preceding post may well have managed to include the most B/bits able to fit neatly on a screen ever . He's maxed it out ! Only someone as dedicated as John is to his art could do it.
That does it I refuse to deal anymore with this uneducated sub normal philistine who has absolutely no regard for his elders and betters nor a smidgen of appreciation of any meaningful technical discussion. and obviously has an exceedingly low boredom threshold
Hopefully he will now crawl back into his pit in the slum pictured below


Johnstone's Lane, Sydney (NSW) a hundred years ago

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Old 10-03-2012, 07:57 PM   #24
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i would have liked to hear the acoustic version he did of Morning Glory (also performed on the Mar 8 1987 radio show)

Gord's voice didn't carry well over his own guitar, Rick's bass and Terry's lead (the last time I saw him play live) during the acoustic version of Shadows at the Songwriters HOF Gala a few years ago...the cbc Canada Live audio link that char had posted is now a dead end ...Gord's voice is stronger these days ...there are a few songs I like with Barry's percussion and/or Mike's strings, otherwise I'm an all trio fan..or even a Lightfoot/Lancaster duo

I don't know where the link to Gord's wonderful I'll Tag Along has gone, regarding the Apr 2012 Q radio performance...there are many acoustic ITA renditions from recent decades

Many have the video (havent seen it online) from Global TV (low quality VHS) of Gord playing acoustic East Of Midnight...it gave me a new appreciation of the song...I might even like an acoustic version of Anything for Love

i'd give anything for acoustic versions ...

today, CBC has most of the broadcasts archived...unlikely that the I+S Reunion raw tapes with Lesson in Love and EOM still exist...Wayne says he did see a snippet of LIL at some point....

Many appreciate that Gord's live shows reproduce his studio recording arrangements (and 'sound') from the Shadows era forward, but I always look forward to an alternative live arrangement ...i don't like the electric piano added to old era songs but I'm certain Mike's just following Gord's instruction... Carter is using some new guitar sounds... I like
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Old 10-04-2012, 05:27 PM   #25
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Default Re: Any ideas about these clips

Nice videos, Char. At first I thought they were blank, but then I clicked up in that whatchacallit and there they were.
Way back when, my Dad played harmonica for a couple, Fred and Joni. Fred sounded kind of like Ian, if I remember correctly. They were called the Nashville Sweethearts. I tried looking them up on yt, but couldn't find them, (too long ago) but instead found another group called the Nashville Sweethearts. I LIKE!


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