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Old 03-16-2008, 10:46 PM   #1
Yuri
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Default A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

My very good friend and multi-talented musician John Lister has just released a CD which has been described as a "classic rock meets new age".

John Lister has composed, performed and produced music for several decades, generally working behind the scenes on music projects for other people. On this, his first solo CD, he performs each track in the studio, not relying on MIDI or sampling or any other automation to create the sounds. The wind chimes you hear are actual wind chimes, recorded in the studio. Some sounds such as flutes or strings are played on a synthesizer, but all of the tracks are recorded live, as they were performed in the studio.

Besides the synthesizer, John plays drums, bass, electric and acoustic guitars, synth guitar, and percussion instruments. The effect on this CD is "Rock group meets orchestra" with tasteful solos from every range of instruments.

The instruments used on this CD range from modern synthesizers to vintage rock instruments, such as a 1939 Hammond "D" organ and Leslie tone cabinet, a vintage early-sixties Gibson SG electric guitar, a 1957 National slide guitar, a five-string fretless bass, and a modern Ovation acoustic guitar. A guitar synthesizer provides many of the very unique tones on this CD, such as the "choir" voices.


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Last edited by Yuri; 03-16-2008 at 10:58 PM.
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Old 03-16-2008, 11:02 PM   #2
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

melodically hypnotizing loving this much. Thanks for posting this Yuri!
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Old 03-17-2008, 07:31 AM   #3
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

Very beautiful, a great talent John is. Thanks Yuri !
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Old 03-17-2008, 04:13 PM   #4
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

John has some nice, (albeit a little too familiar) elements layered over a creatively restricted, depressing (sorry), singular chord progression that goes on for the life of the tune. I know that sounds unkind but the tune goes nowhere creatively and for someone who supposedly has all these credentials the effort really is simplistic and comes up short.

That said, and as a bassist, I really enjoyed his guitar lick and you can tell that is his instrument. He should stick to it and collaborate with some formally trained people who really, actually do play drums and keys,(clearly John doesn't) and, hopefully, who he could fall back on for technical and creative guidance when putting together musical compositions. I assume John must be self taught...

Not bad for a first effort but no commercial viability here...makes me think of Zamfir, actually, from back in the '80's........cheers all.
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Old 03-17-2008, 05:53 PM   #5
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

I felt an explanation of this project may be in order.

The project from which this video comes was originally consigned as a meditation CD, which meant NO drums or rhythm of any kind, and very peaceful, repetitive chords. When the client backed out and changed her mind, I took the project into a slightly different direction, with the gradual addition of classic rock instrumentation which increases the energy and feel of each track.

You state (rather authoritatively) that I 'clearly' do not play drums or keys, but you are quite wrong in that assumption. I have played drums for many years, teaching at the Ontario Conservatory of Music when I first started out. I have also played various keyboards in many situations over a very long period of time, creating succesful jingles, and working with other musicians in too many bands to mention. I won't start dropping names here, some you would recognize, but it is not up to me to defend myself as a musician, it is up to you not to cast insults in the first place.

Your comments on the chord progression sounds very similar to the disparaging one on YouTube, perhaps that has influenced your objectivity.

This piece of music does not show off musicianship, nor is it intended to, other than perhaps the guitar solos, but not all music must be showy to be of good quality, and not all drumming, bass-playing, etc. has to have flash in order to 'prove' that the musician is capable. I find it surprising that you could come to a 'conclusion' about my musical abilities, it shows a real lack of objectivity on your part, and is in fact nothing short of insulting. The drum breaks and keyboard passages in this song are flawlessly performed, yet are fairly simple, as they are intended to be for this style of music.

I was advised by an associate that a video on YouTube would improve visibility by drawing attention to the CD. Becuase YouTube is a place for amateur videos, I went ahead and put the video together with what little video expertise and equipment I have. Obviously, the music was complete before I did the video, so I am 'miming' the instrument parts, and in one of the drum scenes, the visible timing is off. This has nothing to do with the music, nor my ability to play these instruments. Perhaps the video is putting the music in a negative light, by making me appear to be 'faking' it. I am not sure, as this is the first time I have tried doing a music video, and also the first time using YouTube.

I'm actually very surprised and disappointed at your comments, franco, especially coming from another musician. I know there are musicians who only feel 'flashy' and 'fast' songs that really show off musicianship are valid, and there is a place for those, hell I've written them myself, but this track is a relaxing, peaceful piece of inspiring music that takes the emotions from peaceful places on up and then back down again. People who have bought the CD have expressed that it does exactly what it is supposed to, perhaps you were hoping for a different music style? When something is not in the style you prefer, resorting to insults about the person's capabilities won't win you many friends. The drumming and keyboard work on this CD are flawless, granted there is nothing terribly difficult either, other than the organ solo, but a good musician is not afraid to play without the need to show off, if the song requires simple passages. That shows taste, maturity and discernment, not a lack of ability.

Again, I wonder if the video isn't creating a negative impression of the music. I had not heard anything negative until the video was uploaded yesterday. Surely a decent musician isn't going to be confused by an amatuer video to the point where he can't hear what's happening in the music?

Last edited by John Lister; 03-17-2008 at 06:39 PM.
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Old 03-17-2008, 06:53 PM   #6
John Lister
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

Due to the overwhelming number of attacks on YouTube, I have decided to remove the video. The sound clips are all available at the CD webpage, www.johnlister.ca/anewday .

I apologize to those who enjoyed the video, but the poor synchronization between the sound and visuals led many to believe the entire project was merely faked.

Last edited by John Lister; 03-18-2008 at 08:39 AM.
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Old 03-17-2008, 07:41 PM   #7
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

Who the hell is franco ? John I was looking forward to listening to this because if Yuri says it's good - it's got to be good. "Don't let the bastards bring you down" man !

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Old 03-17-2008, 07:56 PM   #8
John Lister
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

Thank you Bill. You can still hear the samples from the seven tracks at www.johnlister.ca/anewday

I took the video down becuase I was badly out of sync with the music and it looked like I was only pretending to be a musician, because my 'finger-syncing' was out of time.

I had a number of people on YouTube tell me it was horrible, and they gave specifics, franco was pretty much saying the same thing, so I took the video down.
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Old 03-17-2008, 10:44 PM   #9
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

Who the hell is Franco, indeed? Pretty bold for someone who joined this group this month and wishes to introduce himself with a snarky remark as a first posting. Constructive criticism this was not.
My apologies to my Corfid family and to John himself as I thoroughly enjoyed the piece and eagerly wished to shared it with this group.
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Old 03-18-2008, 01:38 AM   #10
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

John,
I am sorry that you have had unkind remarks made about your music.
I was here last night and listened to it and I thought it was very beautiful.
I am not one that enjoys new age music that much and I thought your music went way beyond what I expected...boring? I think Franco was just in the mood to be unkind and critical. Makes you wonder how many compositions he has offered up for the world to listen to...

Please don't let the unkindness get you down. There will always be critics but most of them only know what they don't like...they can't and shouldn't speak for the rest of the world.
Best of luck and keep smiling....

Yuri, thanks for posting the video...no apology needed as far as I'm concerned.
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Old 03-18-2008, 04:15 AM   #11
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

Bill, you crossed the line by referring to me as a “bastard” and if you were any kind of a man you’d apologize. Somehow I doubt you have it in you….

John, I gave you my honest critique on your work. You were introduced here as being skilled and multi-talented. I heard rudimentary and average. Now, in addition to being a skilled drummer, you hold yourself out to be a drum instructor here also.

Since, according to your web-site, ‘lister.ca’, you are in Cornwall, if a guy from Ottawa like Lorne Kelly formerly the Drumset Performance Instructor for Carleton University’s Bachelor of Music program (1994 to 2001), currently the Drum Instructor for Algonquin College’s Music and Audio specialty, member of the Vic Firth Education Team and writer for Modern Drummer magazine, or maybe even one of the boys from some of the area bands wanted to sit in on a percussion master class, would Steve’s or Long & McQuade in Ottawa or Melody Music in Cornwall recommend John Lister as the “go to pro” for keyboards and percussion? Not a chance.

What are you actually qualified to do? According to your site, you are an expert on meta-physics as well as a professional photographer, and music production yet nowhere to be found are any credentials showing that you have be educated or formally trained in anything..!!

Did you go to school and did you qualify for the ARCT certificate with the Royal Conservatory of Music so you could teach or are you faking that too? Did you even take any formal training and what Conservatory grade levels did you achieve in performance and theory ? Or is it just more B/S?

Your tune was harmless compared to these wild claims of amazing credentials that are just bull ......

Last edited by franco; 03-18-2008 at 04:26 AM.
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Old 03-18-2008, 08:11 AM   #12
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Franco, let me ask you what 'credentials' most top musicans have, people like Jimi Hendrix, John Bonham for instance, and NO, I am not comparing myself to them. There are drummers like Mick Fleetwood and drummers like Lorne Kelly. Obviously Lorne is a thousand times better technically. But there is more to music than technique, much more. Look at Led Zeppelins John Bonham, and how his tempo would drastically speed up. (eg Dazed and Confused) This is the number one sin of drumming, yet he was widely respected for the feel he brought to every song.

I don't know what "wild claims of amazing credentials" you say I have made. I am an accomplished musician, that's it. I know what I can and cannot do on the instruments that I play. I am 'accomplished' at several instruments, like it or not, and without lessons, like it or not.

This CD of mine began as 'meditation music' and was intended to be hypnotic, with gentle waves of increasing and decreasing energy. It is NOT a showcase piece to demonstrate technical skills, there is little technique required as far as musical chops are concerned. That does not mean that I can not handle more technically demanding songs as a drummer, keyboard player, bassist, etc. The strengths of this CD are in the evocation of emotion and deep feeling, it's more about waves of moods than song structure. For you to therefore assume I am incapable of anything more complex simply shows how limited your thinking is, if you base a person's talent only on the degree of speed and dexterity a particular song may showcase.

As for furthering your attack on me to include photography and other areas, and again to question my 'qualifications', again I remind you that the greatest in any field (and again I am not claiming greatness here) are usually not those who took courses in the subject, it came naturally to them, be it photography, sculpture, playing an instrument or whatever. You say 'self taught' as if it is always a bad thing. How many top ten participants on American Idol had qualified voice instruction? Usually none, which is not to put down music instruction, it is just not the only measure of musical or other ability, as you seem to be stuck on believeing.

I taught advanced music theory in TWO instruments for the Ontario Conservatory, and before that taught at other establishments. I played in my high-school band, yet did not take music at all in high school. I also taught private lessons for many years. One of my students went on to have a succesful career in a rock band, again I am not here to defend myself and will not resort to name-dropping. I was able to do this becuase I STUDIED music theory, not in school, but by reading the same books a teacher would be teaching from. I also went out and watched top musicians to see for myself the practical aspects of what I was learning from textbooks. Sitting on my ass and having someone read it to me would have been easier, I decided to learn it on my own, as I have done with other things which is why I am a succesful business owner today, and yes, I taught myself business management, accounting, and much more the same way.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion and their own preferences, but I am puzzled as to why you think you should ATTACK something you may not like, comments that I am 'clearly' not a drummer or keyboard player for example. Where do you get off on doing this? Who made you an authority on other people's skill levels, especially when all you've seen is a very simple piece of music that is clearly not intended to show musical technique, but to create an entirely different feeling?

You (and everyone) have a perfect right to an opinion, you don't like the song, you hate the chord structure, you find it boring, etc. But to attack someone and claim they are 'clearly' not a drummer or keyboard player simply shows what your own character is made of, ignorance. When you ask if my qualifications are 'MORE BS' you are being ignorant and insulting. What BS are you referring to in the first place? You call me a 'faker' because someone on YouTube said it about my admittedly poor video skills.

Franco, you crossed the line by referring to me as 'clearly' not a drummer, comments about 'BS' etc. and if you were any kind of man you'd apologize. Somehow I doubt you have it in you. . . hey wait a minute, that sounds awfully familiar!

Last edited by John Lister; 03-18-2008 at 12:08 PM.
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Old 03-18-2008, 11:16 AM   #13
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

I really enjoyed that song, John. It's good. I'm glad I got to listen to it before you took it down. One day I was checking out someone's video - exact same one posted more than once. On one there were a bunch of rude comments and on another there were good comments.
"Don't let the bastards bring you down" - I like that song too.
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Old 03-18-2008, 11:55 AM   #14
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

[QUOTE=franco;135876]Bill, you crossed the line by referring to me as a ďbastardĒ and if you were any kind of a man youíd apologize. Somehow I doubt you have it in youÖ.

Calm down sweetheart - I was quoting a well known song by John Koerner. That's why it was in quotation marks since that's how you show it's a quote.

If I wanted to call you something I would do it directly like this: Franco you are a mean spirited jackass who used this forum for purposes it is not designed. Now do us a favor and go away.

Just to be clear: I was not calling you a bastard but I am calling you a jackass, Jackass !

Bill
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Old 03-18-2008, 12:01 PM   #15
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

Thank you guys, and I have three other songs at www.broadjam.com/johnlister including a BLUES number that perhaps does feature a little more musicianship, though I doubt it will meet franco's standards either. It is a simplistic standard blues number, and that's all it's supposed to be.

Another tune is from the "A New Day" CD and a third is kind of a love gone bad song that might be good in a movie setting.

I really do appreciate everyone's comments here, including the constructive portion of franco's. I'm glad my friend Yuri turned me on to this group!
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Old 03-18-2008, 04:20 PM   #16
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Oh, címon John, I have no trouble at all with simplicity and happen to love the blues, there is a beauty in it that appeals to me very much and youíd be really smart to leave this alone now or it wonít go well.

Everyone needs to get this, here and now, especially your newest, bestest bud that meat head BillW

Right from the start of this, --other than calling your submission the way I saw it, my only problem has been with you challenging my judgment by flaunting phony credentials. It is this simple for me, -your tune is what it is! You donít seem to be and you got called out on it!

How many emails and phone calls to fellow musicians in Cornwall do you think it takes to get the ďwholeĒ scoop on your dismal track record over the last 4 years dude?

Iím really gonna resist the urge to go into detail here because I was asked not to by some pretty decent folks, but in my defense it was confirmed 3 ways that you are about as much an accomplished drummer / instructor as you are a shuttle pilot. Yes you can rip off a pretty good Ringo as well as the rest of us when the drummer goes for a pee but the notion of you putting on master classes for, even, the local guys evoked sustained laughter.

We probably should leave it there before I break a promise.

BTW. I listened to ďYouíre GoneĒ. Itís morbid and depressing to the point that if you werenít on Zoloft before you listened, youíd need it after. You do have some production shit going on thatís useful. Keep it up!
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Old 03-18-2008, 06:07 PM   #17
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Let's have a quick review. I post a song you don't like. You criticise the song AND rip into me personally as a musician. I defend my position, then you say "leave this alone now or it won't go well"? That sounds an awful lot like a threat, and I sure hope it wasn't. ...and shouldn't it be I suggesting that YOU leave it alone?

I fail to see where I 'flaunted phony credentials'. Nowhere on my website do I claim to have credentials, all I mentioned in my defense to you, was that I taught at a respected learning establishment due to my understanding of music theory and practical knowledge. It was YOU who came up with the whole "Phony Credentials" thing, and you came up with that out of nowhere, as I've never claimed to have any credentials, nor are there any mention of it on my website. This 'master class' thing is another of your inventions, I never said it, I am not teaching lessons any longer, I haven't in decades, so why do you keep harping on this?

As for implying that you called fellow Cornwall musicians to discover a 'dismal track record', I have only lived here since September and don't know any of the local musicians, nor do they know me. The studio has not been advertised, there have not been any clients yet, becuase the studio's construction and decor is not quite completed. These 'local guys' you speak of only exist in your mind, dude, as I have not been a part of any local music scene here. Nice try though, you seem to have some experience at this - putting people down for no good reason. I have no idea who you made a promise to, but they must live in your mind, as there are no people in this town who know me. Oh, I should make a correction, I recently quit a local band that had not played in nearly a year, and I had played the local bar scene with them prior to that. The drummer who is the leader was quite pissed at me when I told him I was moving on and would no longer be a part of his band. He would be the only person I have known who may have ill feeings towards me, but certainly not due to my capabilities as a musician.

Yes, the tune "You're Gone" was written specifically to illustrate a lost love, and is intended to be a downer. I'm glad it created the desired effect. Apparantly my music can move you after all!

Funny how you didn't mention the blues tune that was posted where the downer tune is, perhaps you liked that one, and heaven forbid you say anything good about anyone.

What is downright wrong here, is your entirely fabricated story about my 'track record'. You are making this shit up on the spot, totally fabricating it. Go get a real life, or if you want to write fiction, take a course on becoming an author, maybe your fantasy world can earn you some money that way, assuming you had the qualifications for it.

Fabricating total lies about real people is not going to win you any friends, and in fact, it is illegal, in case you weren't aware. My music background is in an entirely different city, near Toronto, not here. So these promises you made not to spill the beans about this fabricated 'dismal track record' are all in your mind.

You go on to say "Even the local guys sustained laughter", who are these, the people that live in your head? No local people know of me, other than the musicians in the band I mentioned, and I was well respected there, both as a guitarist and as bassist, as the situation demanded over the time I was with them.

As for me putting on 'master classes', those are your words, not mine. I taught rudimentary drumming technique, and can hold my own when laying down tracks in the studio, I said I was accomplished at several instruments, so keep it straight, although the version you seem to prefer is all in your head, not here, not in this town, not this person. You've fabricated a pretty detailed story about a guy who supposedly has a local track record, complete with people laughing at him, and who supposedly claims he has some credentials, and is still considering himself to be a drum teacher, all claims I have never made.

So watch out, it's called slander and it's illegal. What the hell do you have against a total stranger anyhow? This is what mystifies me the most, that you are so hell-bent on insulting and putting down a total stranger. Just what do you get out of it, some sick enjoyment? Give it up man, you're making a laughing stock out of yourself.
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Old 03-18-2008, 06:47 PM   #18
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You win, I'm done........goodbye
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Old 03-18-2008, 06:51 PM   #19
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Yuri, please since the video if gone and this has gotten nasty and I am trying to restrain myself would you please delete the topic, only you can do that since you started this topic. I don't think we need another war on corfid, it has been so nice and quiet until Franco showed up. He needs to go back to worshipping Ozzy Osbourn and leave the Lightfoot community.
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Old 03-18-2008, 06:55 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brink- View Post
Yuri, please since the video if gone and this has gotten nasty and I am trying to restrain myself would you please delete the topic, only you can do that since you started this topic. I don't think we need another war on corfid, it has been so nice and quiet until Franco showed up. He needs to go back to worshipping Ozzy Osbourn and leave the Lightfoot community.

Better still, please delete my account, it's clear I don't belong here. Sorry for the inconvenience and best regards to all...........peace!
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Old 03-18-2008, 07:07 PM   #21
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Better still, please delete my account, it's clear I don't belong here. Sorry for the inconvenience and best regards to all...........peace!
Well...do you even like Gordon Lightfoot? If you do, you belong. Too bad you went over the line with your 'critique'...accusations and assumptions, etc. but oh well. Hey - I don't even care for some things I've posted on Corfid (what was I thinking? Was I in a bad mood?)-but I'll feel bad, own up etc., because ultimately, I want to be here because I'm a fan of Lightfoot's music . And I want to be here more because of the wonderful people here.
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Old 03-18-2008, 07:21 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by podunklander View Post
Well...do you even like Gordon Lightfoot? If you do, you belong. Too bad you went over the line with your 'critique'...accusations and assumptions, etc. but oh well. Hey - I don't even care for some things I've posted on Corfid (what was I thinking? Was I in a bad mood?)-but I'll feel bad, own up etc., because ultimately, I want to be here because I'm a fan of Lightfoot's music . And I want to be here more because of the wonderful people here.

You are an extremely gracious man and I am greatful for your words but this may have gone way too far to save. I am loathe to admit that I can become too tenacious when I am convinced of my position. I regret offending anyone, especially John, however I feel he was overstating his qualifications. That said, in the big scheme of thing what does it really matter.

In any event I've caused trouble, I see that, and will suck it up. Best I resign and bugger off..."like a ghost in a wishing well"
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Old 03-18-2008, 08:50 PM   #23
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I will be deleting the nastiness..my goodness Franco the attitude and personal slagging along with the assumptions are really not necessary. We don't speak to each other like that on this board and it seems you joined for the sole purpose of being mean. It's all negative criticism and said in a very ugly way. Yuri was kind enough to want to share a friends' music and we appreciate it for what it is. We don't go off on a person or their talents because none of us are perfect at what we do and wouldn't want the hurtful remarks which you have posted to be said about our efforts.
You need not have posted at all.
I'm sure there are other things on the internet that you can find to amuse yourself.
Please stop posting such crassness to build yourself up.
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Old 03-18-2008, 09:06 PM   #24
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Thank you so much Char. We all really appreciate you and all you do for us. I guess the Franco of the world will come and go. Like every other person who has read his posts I wonder why he even came here.


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Old 03-18-2008, 09:26 PM   #25
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Default Re: A New Day - "Classic Rock Meets New Age"

Well, I just canít believe where this innocent little thread has gone. I was delighted with the opportunity to share some work produced by talented musician who Iíve been proud to call my friend since I was 17 years of age. Johnís sincerity, ingenuity, intelligence and talent are self evident and need no defending from anyone. Diplomas, documents, certificates of accomplishments? Fine, but the school of life has much to offer as well. On this topic Iíll leave pedigrees to the dogs.

I have to wonder what brought Franco to this newsgroup as it is my understanding that although Gordon Lightfoot had some vocal training in his adolescence and studied music composition at the Westlake Music Academy, he had no formal training on the guitar. I have heard Gord himself lament that he has to use the capo and is not a great guitarist. Regardless, the end result became timeless melodies and even the existence of this group.

I shall look into removing this thread in itís entirety as requested. My only regret that it has given Franco a platform, not to offer polite constructive criticism but rather to display his self importance and venomous views. I regret that our newest member Franco came in with all guns a-blazing with his introductory post to this newsgroup - a fine way to say hello. I will however look forward his contributions and insights on Lightfoot topics in future posts.

Once again, my apologies to John and to my Corfid family.

Yuri
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